Sign in to follow this  
Followers 0
newborn

[Have Your Say] Arena modes

78 posts in this topic

So, I've been thinking about modes a bit lately and I thought I might think out loud and get some community feedback. I'm hoping this can become a regular thing during Early Access, as long as everyone can behave themselves and not rage ;)

 

Anyway, Arena modes. The core of these modes is "Players spawn with all weapons, a bunch of ammo and a decent amount of armor and then proceed to kill each other until there is no one left". There's no weapons to gather and no items to time -- it's purely a test of your combat skills.

 

The Arena modes we currently have planned are Arena Free For All (3-10 players, no teams), Arena Team Deathmatch (3-10 players, teams) and Arena 1v1 (2 players). 

 

Traditionally, these modes are round based with each round lasting until a single player is left. This isn't something I've personally ever been a big fan of but the design of Reflex isn't all about my personal preferences.

 

We could remove the rounds though and simply respawn players when they are fragged. This would make the pace of these modes more in-line with other modes and players wouldn't be forced to float around the map dead, waiting for the round to end.

 

You would lose the thrill of being the last one alive though. This buzz could be replaced by changing the scoring to reward kill streaks -- players get +1 points for each frag they make without dying. You'd also lose the occasional satisfaction of taking out an entire enemy team yourself.

 

Powerups are another thing that is missing from these modes. They would have no place in A1v1 but could work in AFFA and ATDM if they were spawned every 3 rounds or so, especially considering that all of our powerups will be designed to have a counter-powerup (For example, Carnage does 4x damage but Resist reduces all damage taken by 75%).

 

Remember, this is a discussion, not a design decision. The idea is to challenge the existing ideas about Arena modes and see if we can improve on them.

 

Any ideas or feedback is welcome, except for one thing -- we won't be implementing both styles. Too many game modes will dilute the playerbase and make it more difficult to find a game.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I always enjoyed Clan Arena in QL a lot....simply because it's a pretty "relaxed" mode. No team damage .... just frag around and the feeling of ev. going 1v3 and win is great.

 

Imo Reflex could need a more..."relaxed" ..."casual" mode. Normal DM is always such a hectic mess :D

 

That's my opinion ...from a casual gamer.

 

Regards

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think NTF (Not Team Fortress) could make a great addition to Reflex. It'd be a very fun casual mode where friends can work together, which is definitely something players coming from other genres/games would relate to quite a bit. Maybe have a set of classes, each with certain weapons unique to that class and only spawn powerups, etc.

namejs2002 likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Agree with Spannzer, I think Clan Arena (and the proposed FFA Arena) are a little too primitive even if they are fun but something like NTF would be even better!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Make "Defrag" or "Race mode" like in Quake Live, where the players are ghosts. Suddenly, there were only 2 maps in Quake Live :c

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I've always been a big CA fan, but I think the thing most people like in CA is the immediate access to all weapons, and a full stack.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

we were playing with just stake guns, blaster and melee today. and we were thinking that a rabbit/quadhog/infected type mode would be really good, anything where you have to chase someone down / run away with loadout that limits your range. actual tag is something I would enjoy a lot if you could use a projectile weapon to tag or something (tag counts as like any non splash dmg dealt perhaps). Maybe give the "it" person slightly longer/faster weapons as the round progresses but get less points for tags with them: so they just start with axe to tag, then get nades, then rocket, then last rail if they haven't tagged anyone by then, that way its not totally frustrating for ppl who can't move well enough to catch anyone yet.

namejs2002 likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

These game modes always lack something to motivate you to move around the map, and in large, open maps players often just stay in one comfortable area and snipe the other team with rail. If players would slowly gain health/armor by moving around the map(the faster you are the more you gain) the match should be faster and more exciting with less dull moments.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

If possible I would rather have both, like a classic CA and than have some derivative modes based on it, like the one you have described. I think it would be better to have them as separate modes rather than try to merge them both and have to choose between one or another.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I believe everyone that has played both Q2/Q3 Rocket Arena mod agrees that Rocket Arena destroys the QL Clan Arena.

 

The fact  that you have multiple arenas in the same map and people can easily choose between what arena to play is extremely good, it is like having multiple maps inside the same game.

 

I would be extremely happy if Reflex chooses a "rocket arena" method and not a clan arena one.

AthoS and namejs2002 like this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I believe everyone that has played both Q2/Q3 Rocket Arena mod agrees that Rocket Arena destroys the QL Clan Arena.

 

The fact  that you have multiple arenas in the same map and people can easily choose between what arena to play is extremely good, it is like having multiple maps inside the same game.

 

I would be extremely happy if Reflex chooses a "rocket arena" method and not a clan arena one.

Why not both c:

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I like the idea of clan arena style modes but if you were to go the route of kill-streaks rather than round-based, I would need a few more details on the following:

 

 

 

Players spawn with all weapons, a bunch of ammo and a decent amount of armor

 

How much is a bunch of ammo? 50% for each weapon? I ask because I worry a bit about running out of ammo since this is a kill-streak based mode instead of rounds (meaning you can't slowly reduce players meaning less ammo used, it means if the server has 4 players, there will always be 3 other players potentially attacking you).

 

This may also come up -- but not sure how often -- but in TDM, you could be a more spammy player with RL, GL, etc (especially if you are trying to get your team set up for good map control) or even get the power-up and need to push for your team, you may run out of ammo.

 

Question is: are there any plans to get ammo back? Most players rely on rockets, rail, and lightning to kill so they are the most likely to run out first. If a player is stronger with lightning than a rocket launcher, they may become useless faster because their best weapon is now out (especially if you spawn with a bunch of armour in this case because the lightning gun feels like a finisher weapon ATM).

 

How much armour are we spawning with as well? 50? 100?

 

 

 

Arena Team Deathmatch (3-10 players, teams)

 

Wanted to know as well if this would be per player kill-streaks or team kill-streaks?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I know some players love to hate on arena mode, but I really enjoy it, and it happens to be popular in QL.

 

I would definitely support a small variety of arena modes.  I like the idea of a mode with quick respawns, as long as there is also a rounds mode.

 

Carnage powerup: Sounds interesting, but it's hard to say how that would affect gameplay.  Might encourage camping/griefing, might encourage some really creative teamwork from more competitive teams.

 

I was also thinking about the possibility of having a casual/competitive split in arena modes, kind of like what Counter Strike does.  Maybe competitive could have vampire damage, headshot damage etc, less ammo, teamsize/weapon/respawn restrictions... Stuff like that.  Just throwing ideas out there.

 

I've always been a big CA fan, but I think the thing most people like in CA is the immediate access to all weapons, and a full stack.

 

I can't speak for everyone, but I defend arena because it shifts focus away from item timings, and toward clever movement, positioning, dodging, weapon choice and aiming.  Of course non-arena has all these things, but they are all heavily contingent upon the premise that your item timing is strong.

 

I always enjoyed Clan Arena in QL a lot....simply because it's a pretty "relaxed" mode. No team damage .... just frag around and the feeling of ev. going 1v3 and win is great.

 

Imo Reflex could need a more..."relaxed" ..."casual" mode. Normal DM is always such a hectic mess  :D

 

That's my opinion ...from a casual gamer.

 

Regards

 

I also enjoy that arena can be a lot more casual and laid-back.

 

However, I just wanted to deflate a common complaint from non-arena players that say arena is easy or can't be competitive.  Absolutely not true.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I think CA is a really big must to draw in some players, and I agree with the points that havok made. Not only that but because people have a full stack it means they can actually explore the maps with a bit more ease and understand it more when you have to fight as well. Having various other quirky game modes that don't focus on the main basics on the game won't really prove a benefit to me. I learned how to play Quake and CPMA in CA because of the reasons mentioned and it really helped my understand the core mechanics before I jumped in to 1v1.

 

There is also a lot of negativity about the game or game modes being "too easy" which to me isn't the right attitude for a game that you want to grow and be popular, whether people like it or not if you don't make your game easy to grasp and give new players a chance to enjoy themselves they won't keep on playing this game, especially in such a volatile market for FPS.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'd definitely like to have a round based mode in the game. If this means we can either have Arena round based or not and there is no other round based game mode planned I am all for Arena with rounds. It is really a "laid back" alternative, as already said, and welcomed diversion from other modes. I have no problem waiting the rest of the round to respawn, maybe due to my CS background. Especially if you play this team-wise you can still talk to your buddies and have fun watching him struggle ;)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I'd rather see less supported game modes than having so many that the community feel segmented.

 

Just something to think about.

 

That's a good point.  Spreading the arena community too thin won't do anyone any good.  Best to keep the number of modes to a bare minimum.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

We could remove the rounds though and simply respawn players when they are fragged. This would make the pace of these modes more in-line with other modes and players wouldn't be forced to float around the map dead, waiting for the round to end.

 

Isn't it just regular modes then?

 

I personally hate Arena modes in, well, arena fps games. I don't think they fit the "fast paced" criteria.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Isn't it just regular modes then?

 

I personally hate Arena modes in, well, arena fps games. I don't think they fit the "fast paced" criteria.

 

There's still the difference of no item pick ups.  Also, arena doesn't affect your speed or mobility.  I would argue that liberal use of rocket jumps can make the mode even faster than other modes.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

CA seems to be a time-tested solution, but if we want to go with the below...

 

The idea is to challenge the existing ideas about Arena modes and see if we can improve on them.

 

A round-based clan arena mode with the economy aspect of CS could work.

 

You start off with your usual default arsenal from non-arena modes if you previously died. At the start of every round, each team member gets a pre-set amount of credits. You get a bonus amount if your team won the previous round, whether you died or not. Your credit balance carries over from round to round. You (on an individual level) can earn credits for kills and assists as well. Credits can be used during the round start countdown to purchase armor and weapons, each with their own credit value. If your team is falling behind, you can collectively decide to save up credits for a round or two so that your team can catch up on the equipment side of things. Credit values for armor/equipment can be adjusted over the course of the game's development for balancing.

 

Again, it's just an idea. If it doesn't prove to work, I'll be happy to play regular CA/Rocket Arena.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

CA seems to be a time-tested solution, but if we want to go with the below...

 

 

A round-based clan arena mode with the economy aspect of CS could work.

 

You start off with your usual default arsenal from non-arena modes if you previously died. At the start of every round, each team member gets a pre-set amount of credits. You get a bonus amount if your team won the previous round, whether you died or not. Your credit balance carries over from round to round. You (on an individual level) can earn credits for kills and assists as well. Credits can be used during the round start countdown to purchase armor and weapons, each with their own credit value. If your team is falling behind, you can collectively decide to save up credits for a round or two so that your team can catch up on the equipment side of things. Credit values for armor/equipment can be adjusted over the course of the game's development for balancing.

 

Again, it's just an idea. If it doesn't prove to work, I'll be happy to play regular CA/Rocket Arena.

 

I think implementing any kind of credits/economy would put way too much downtime between rounds and lengthen full matches.

 

Plus you would be creating an unequal playing field between teams. I know most people love CA just because it creates a level playing field and places a greater focus on aim and movement since everyone starts with the exact same armoury,

AthoS likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
 

CA seems to be a time-tested solution, but if we want to go with the below...

 

 

A round-based clan arena mode with the economy aspect of CS could work.

 

You start off with your usual default arsenal from non-arena modes if you previously died. At the start of every round, each team member gets a pre-set amount of credits. You get a bonus amount if your team won the previous round, whether you died or not. Your credit balance carries over from round to round. You (on an individual level) can earn credits for kills and assists as well. Credits can be used during the round start countdown to purchase armor and weapons, each with their own credit value. If your team is falling behind, you can collectively decide to save up credits for a round or two so that your team can catch up on the equipment side of things. Credit values for armor/equipment can be adjusted over the course of the game's development for balancing.

 

Again, it's just an idea. If it doesn't prove to work, I'll be happy to play regular CA/Rocket Arena.

 

While weapon/armor purchase before rounds seems to work well in CS, I wouldn't be a fan of applying it to Reflex.

 

For one, I'm not sure how much skill that really adds to a game like Reflex.  I'm not a big fan of competitive CS modes so correct me if I'm wrong.  Also, as I said earlier, I enjoy this mode because it frees you to focus your attention completely on just tracking down your enemy and getting the frag.  Being unable to figure out what weapon/armor the enemy has seems to me like adding in a somewhat random variable.  I think arena is great because everyone has exactly the same potential to frag each other at all times (positioning aside), and weapon/armor buys would disrupt that skill balance.

 

I know most people love CA just because it creates a level playing field and places a greater focus on aim and movement since everyone starts with the exact same armoury,

 

Well said.

AthoS likes this

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!


Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.


Sign In Now
Sign in to follow this  
Followers 0