Jump to content
Username

[idea] Assignable player outline to their current stack/HP

Recommended Posts

I've also had ideas like this. Subtle visual indications of enemy health would be cool. However, connecting outline color to health would mess with people seeing as how in team game modes, the outline is locked to team color. Perhaps an approach similar to what Mechassault did would work. For the Robot model, showing the armor becoming more and more worn with large cracks and holes showing off blinking LEDs or whatnot as their health becomes lower. And large gashes and increasing amounts of blood covering the body/armor for the Human model. With that system, you would be able to tell roughly how much health your opponent has just by looking at them.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Being able to see each others stacks is a bad idea for something like duel, since a big part of duel is the two players estimations of each others stacks. A lot of decisions made are based on these estimations. removing that element will remove a players ability to make an incorrect choice based on what they think somebody's stack is, witch dumbs the game down. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Being able to see each others stacks is a bad idea for something like duel, since a big part of duel is the two players estimations of each others stacks. A lot of decisions made are based on these estimations. removing that element will remove a players ability to make an incorrect choice based on what they think somebody's stack is, witch dumbs the game down. 

 

Not necessarily. If you're an experienced player, you know how stacked your opponent is based on which side of the map they are on anyways. For example, if your opponent is out of control and they need to heal up, and they retreated to a side of the map where a pair of HP bubbles is, you know they're going to heal up anyways. I never said anything about showing how much armor your opponent has, just their HP. So you could see that your opponent has like maybe 50 hp or so, but they could have 200RA, 100YA, you really wouldn't know unless you saw/heard them pick up the item. Also, visual indications of approximate HP would help show how much damage you are doing to your opponent, moreso than screams from an enemy when you shoot them. If a new player saw a shiny robot in nigh-perfect condition in front of them, they might think "He might take a few rockets/stakes to kill." If they were to see a robot with wires hanging out, sparks coming out of them and wear on their armor, they would think "He's almost dead." Instead of just not knowing how much health an enemy has.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Not necessarily. If you're an experienced player, you know how stacked your opponent is based on which side of the map they are on anyways. For example, if your opponent is out of control and they need to heal up, and they retreated to a side of the map where a pair of HP bubbles is, you know they're going to heal up anyways. I never said anything about showing how much armor your opponent has, just their HP. So you could see that your opponent has like maybe 50 hp or so, but they could have 200RA, 100YA, you really wouldn't know unless you saw/heard them pick up the item. Also, visual indications of approximate HP would help show how much damage you are doing to your opponent, moreso than screams from an enemy when you shoot them. If a new player saw a shiny robot in nigh-perfect condition in front of them, they might think "He might take a few rockets/stakes to kill." If they were to see a robot with wires hanging out, sparks coming out of them and wear on their armor, they would think "He's almost dead." Instead of just not knowing how much health an enemy has.

 

was a response to the OP, who only said "Stack"- also i think visual cues like sparks and wires are a bit harder to pick up on due to the speed of the enemies, maybe outline color would work better... but the point is that a newbie should have to learn to estimate enemy health instead of relying on a cue. this kind of thing would not encourage them to learn that skill, but would encourage a newbie to wait until their enemy is in sight to find out their stack, rather than training them to pick up on how much stack someone will have based on their movements and not appearance.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

was a response to the OP, who only said "Stack"- also i think visual cues like sparks and wires are a bit harder to pick up on due to the speed of the enemies, maybe outline color would work better... but the point is that a newbie should have to learn to estimate enemy health instead of relying on a cue. this kind of thing would not encourage them to learn that skill, but would encourage a newbie to wait until their enemy is in sight to find out their stack, rather than training them to pick up on how much stack someone will have based on their movements and not appearance.

 

Well, the only reason I suggested the idea is because it's difficult to tell how much HP an enemy has with the audio cues for hp being almost indistinguishable. I mean, the screaming noises tell you how much hp they have anyways, so if you can't hear or distinguish those sounds, visual cues are nice to have. I agree with you when you say that players should have to learn how to estimate how much of a "stack" their opponent has, but audio cues don't tell you how much armor they have, and neither should visual cues. In 1v1, unless an opponent failed an RJ several times, they shouldn't be low on HP until you fight them anyways. Also, I think it would be confusing for a lot of people if the outlines represented anything but what team you're on.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I like the whole "broken robot" thing even if it is hard to pick up on at full speed, even just for the eye candy. Loadout does this, although being third person it's a lot slower on movement and you tend to keep enemies in your sights for a lot longer. But in addition to hardcore competitive FPS Reflex is going for visual flair and this could be a nice touch.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Not a fan of such idea. Lets say you took 2x25 near the LG on aero like 5 sec ago, you had a fight and dont want to pursue your oponent into that room, you know he wont heal up because you took those just beforehand not because you've seen him near the tp with red outline, I think its important for people to train their short memory and trying to stack what item they have picked up and it improves important item cycle in the long run. Its like that QL idea of adding 'clock' on item spawns so you dont need to know the time, you can see it :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

in team games it would be better to change the color of the player model than the outline, i really dont think the outlines a good idea overall. the game is supposed to be difficult to aim and see. the use of an outline defeats that and puts us on par with warsow.

imo i think whoever was coding just wanted to try to do outlines and it worked so they stayed in the game. the chances of someone intentionally adding this feature from our community on purpose doesnt seem likely

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The game is supposed to be difficult to aim and see.

Wait what ? No I don't think the learning curve is supposed to come from the fact that you can't see what's going on... Maybe you're thinking of Battlefield ? I think almost everyone has been using some sort of brightskin since OSP on quake 3.

 

imo i think whoever was coding just wanted to try to do outlines and it worked so they stayed in the game. the chances of someone intentionally adding this feature from our community on purpose doesnt seem likely

I'm pretty sure it comes from the fact that they wanted to add custom skin, with the possibility of paid vanity DLC down the road, which would be pointless if everyone uses ugly green brightskins.

 

 

I really like the idea of outlines myself. I think they're not looking perfect just yet (they have quite a bit of aliasing and as soon as a model is a few meters away you pretty much only see the outline, not the model itself) but the idea is here and I'm confident they'll look great by the time the game gets nearer to completion.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

in team games it would be better to change the color of the player model than the outline, i really dont think the outlines a good idea overall. the game is supposed to be difficult to aim and see. the use of an outline defeats that and puts us on par with warsow.

imo i think whoever was coding just wanted to try to do outlines and it worked so they stayed in the game. the chances of someone intentionally adding this feature from our community on purpose doesnt seem likely

Idk what community you are talking about but in quake high visibility is everything. Bad visibility mainly just fucks people like me who are colorblind, that has got nothing to do with skill.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

cpm community

i can see your point to cater to the 1% but from the highest level of gameplay its cheesy and cliche. there are alot of games that use player outlines for various purposes but for use as an ENEMY you might as well just be using a wallhack. im sorry but im 100% against the player outlines as much as cell shading from 10 years ago.

wolf enemy territory is one of the few games that had the right idea there was regular and pro modes or regular and hardcore. to cater to the masses in an fps to be taken seriously from both sides you need to have this separation of rule sets for fun and proper play im sorry.

its a choice the team will have to make and in a game like this, choices are atleast 75% of the issues that you run into and the choices you make are going to define what the game will be. arqon and i did 90% talking and 10% work and i got ridiculed everyday unable to explain "what i did in promode" but im in the special thanks for a reason and im proud of what i did for the game

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

cpm community

i can see your point to cater to the 1% but from the highest level of gameplay its cheesy and cliche. there are alot of games that use player outlines for various purposes but for use as an ENEMY you might as well just be using a wallhack. im sorry but im 100% against the player outlines as much as cell shading from 10 years ago.

 

This has got to be the most retarded thing I have read on the forums. Please make actual arguments instead of calling out the cpma boogeyman and bringing up irrelevant things like cell shading.  

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Wait what ? No I don't think the learning curve is supposed to come from the fact that you can't see what's going on... Maybe you're thinking of Battlefield ? I think almost everyone has been using some sort of brightskin since OSP on quake 3.

 

I'm pretty sure it comes from the fact that they wanted to add custom skin, with the possibility of paid vanity DLC down the road, which would be pointless if everyone uses ugly green brightskins.

 

the game is supposed to be difficult to aim and see.

sorry i could have phrased that differently i mean there is supposed to be bright skins but not an outline that instantly tells you where someone is, thats just absurd when you think about it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This has got to be the most retarded thing I have read on the forums. Please make actual arguments instead of calling out the cpma boogeyman and bringing up irrelevant things like cell shading.  

actually its a very solid point and the more i read this forum the more i can tell that you lack the ability to know what is necessary to create good gameplay standards. its a forum take what i say however you want, but i guarantee i know im the Gregory fucking House at this shit and you'll never convince me otherwise. yeah sometimes ill be wrong but so is he, but in the end ill be right almost everytime

 

and for the record, i will always believe arQon is carrmack for my own personal reasons. which btw, would NEVER have player outlines, sorry

 

ESDF for life bye.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

while im at it and your waking the creative beast why dont you add something for depth perception for me because i have none, then add player outlines for the colorblind guy, then aim assist like console fps games for the new players that cant keep up.

 

the games on a tier way above your head and has the potential to be something QW and CPM players can both play for the next 10 years and without a HOUSE or that 1 guy like robert bowling who fixed COD then they fired him only to bring him back years later to LEAD titan fall which was the first COD that actually performed properly and the sole reason advanced warfare runs just as well. 

 

if you think this games going to end up being the "ninox mouse" of games built by a community without a leader that truly knows how to make choices your going to end up like warsow. i watched their forum exactly like im watching this game being developed and its happening all over again

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

As a general message to people on the forums: Knock this shit off. If you can't have a single gameplay discussion without turning it into an argument.

you just proved my previous message thank you. ill go back to hiding newborn, been fun

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I so want to chime in on this bashing. However, I'll respect Newborns wishes and put my 2c on the OP post.

 

Player outlines for health,

 

Duel,, Nope.

TeamGames,, Nope.

 

You should know what your opponents stack is. Situational awareness > outlines and broken bots.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
 

actually its a very solid point

 

Why dont we go over your points so far on why outlines are bad:

 

"cheesy and cliche"

 

I suppose you view the entire quake series as cheesy and cliche, since the entire quake series has brightskins. Gameplay > visuals every time, and outlines contribute to the gameplay by increasing visiblity. You should never be having problems because the enemy model isnt that distinct from the background

 

"you might as well just be using a wallhack."

 

"then aim assist like console fps games for the new players that cant keep up."

 

There is a big, big difference between the advantages an outline gives a player and a wallhack or aim assist. I dont think I need to explain that to you.

 

 

 i know im the Gregory fucking House at this shit and you'll never convince me otherwise. yeah sometimes ill be wrong but so is he, but in the end ill be right almost everytime

 

 

 

 

the games on a tier way above your head and has the potential to be something QW and CPM players can both play for the next 10 years and without a HOUSE or that 1 guy like robert bowling who fixed COD then they fired him only to bring him back years later to LEAD titan fall which was the first COD that actually performed properly and the sole reason advanced warfare runs just as well. 

 

if you think this games going to end up being the "ninox mouse" of games built by a community without a leader that truly knows how to make choices your going to end up like warsow. i watched their forum exactly like im watching this game being developed and its happening all over again

 

You really have quite the ego, dont you?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

sorry i could have phrased that differently i mean there is supposed to be bright skins but not an outline that instantly tells you where someone is, thats just absurd when you think about it.

 

Oh OK, that makes sense then.

But I still think it's a matter of tweaking the outlines and not the idea of outlines themselves. I think a more discreet outline (for example it could have some transparency, or be slightly affected by lighting so it's not as bright if the player is in the shadows) would be possible.

Also, a big bright green keel basically instantly tells you where someone is, I don't think it's very different from outlines in that regard.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.

×