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B&D mode

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Hi i was just wondering if you think about add this bomb and defuse mode from cs. I dunno how much its already popular in warsow but i think its cool mode and with some good maps it can be really cool. What do you think? Also i like Reflex how it is now, i dont want have reflex ala csgo. This is just simple question for devs.

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it's just FFA.

 

see, in CS, you move slower. maps are relatively bigger. it's possible for someone to get to bomb site, and the remaining enemies actually have to walk back there. possibly falling to ambush.

in reflex, you can get to anywhere in the map in 3 seconds.

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Lol ofc it will be never like csgo (and its really not the goal), i think in warsow it is p fun. I think this mode is p much like defend/attack in arena fps game but with objective plant/defuse bomb. I think make some big maps focused on objective, it can be great and fun casual game mode.

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1 hour ago, Sky said:

see, in CS, you move slower. maps are relatively bigger. it's possible for someone to get to bomb site, and the remaining enemies actually have to walk back there. possibly falling to ambush.

in reflex, you can get to anywhere in the map in 3 seconds.

Then reduce the map timer to 10 seconds and the bomb timer to 4 seconds :-)

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4 hours ago, Vingtner said:

I do not like it. The point of Reflex is to go fast while killing others. The plant & defuse gamemode is inherently slow which is the direct opposite of core Reflex gameplay.

What? Bomb is very fast paced mode, more fast paced than CTF for that matter. In my opinion, It would work out great in Reflex. I played Bomb pickups since the very first release of the mode in Warsow and it was probably the biggest success that the game ever had with any mode they have released and it also kept the game alive. It was always unpredictable and players would develop great teamplay. 

This is how it works in Warsow and it would also work out in Reflex.

You have 2 teams. The offense and defense. At halftime, the teams are swapped meaning the offense becomes defense and vice versa.

  • If you are the attacker, your team's goal is to place the bomb on one of the 2 bomb sites (Both would be marked as A and B). At the start of each round, one player from the offense team is given the bomb which can be dropped for another player. Other members of the team must escort him to one of the bomb sites in order for him to plant it. 
  • When the player with the bomb reaches the bombsite, the bomb is dropped and it creates a circle around it and one of the offense players must stand inside of it to plant it. Once the bomb is planted, the offense team's mission is to stop the defenders from trying to defuse it. If the bomb explodes, the offense team wins, if the bomb is defused, the defenders win. 
  • The defense team's mission is to stop the attackers from planting/arming the bomb. If you do not succeed at it, the bomb will be planted and armed which means your team will have to kill the offense team in order to be able to defuse (you can defuse it without killing the offense team but that's going to be fucking hard, trust me). In order to defuse the bomb, you will have to stand in the circle. 
  • There's few winning exceptions as well. If the defense team dies, the offense team wins. If the offense team dies and the bomb was not armed, the defense wins.

Basic info about the mode:

  • 30 rounds just like in CS GO
  • Roundtime: 1 min (can be extended to 1 min 25 seconds with a late plant)
  • Planttime: 4 seconds
  • Bombtime: 25 seconds (18 seconds until you have to defuse the bomb)
  • Defusetime: 7 seconds

3 Classes to pick from:

  • Bolt + Rocket Launcher + additional plasma, sg, burst gun, gl and axe.
  • Rocket Launcher + Ion Cannon + additional plasma, sg, burst gun, gl and axe.
  • Bolt + Ion Cannon + additional plasma, sg, burst gun, gl and axe.

All those listed above can be changed while playtesting the mode to make sure it suits Reflex

Here's a video of 2 professional teams playing in the finals, this video is not as hectic and chaotic as posted above. 

 

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I think AFPS really do need a good objective game mode. I always felt like capture points would be a lot of fun. But I guess, historically speaking, it wasn't that popular in QL? Those warsow videos do actually look pretty fun. Having a more structured emphasis on attacking and defending areas looks like a great set up for some sick game play. Though I'm not a fan of B&D specifically, as the one life per round can get boring, and it can still end up with the rounds boiling down to CA rounds.

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7 hours ago, Vingtner said:

I do not like it. The point of Reflex is to go fast while killing others. The plant & defuse gamemode is inherently slow which is the direct opposite of core Reflex gameplay.

Did I miss a memo? When did this become the point of Reflex?

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18 minutes ago, Vingtner said:

 

I vividly remember that being the whole point of CPMA and Reflex is inspired by CPMA, no?

The point of Challenge ProMode was to adapt Quake 3 to suit competition and part of that was to include the movement mechanics from QuakeWorld and Quake 2. More techniques to master so the game would be harder, more options at any given point so the tactics would be deeper and more speed when moving around so the pace would be higher.

You can argue whether or not they succeeded (people have been at it for the last 16 years on esr), but that was the point of CPM. How much fun it is to fly around and shoot things is just a side effect.

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4 hours ago, Pill_ said:

The point of Challenge ProMode was to adapt Quake 3 to suit competition and part of that was to include the movement mechanics from QuakeWorld and Quake 2. More techniques to master so the game would be harder, more options at any given point so the tactics would be deeper and more speed when moving around so the pace would be higher.

You can argue whether or not they succeeded (people have been at it for the last 16 years on esr), but that was the point of CPM. How much fun it is to fly around and shoot things is just a side effect.

 

Fair enough.

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On 27/12/2015 at 1:41 PM, Sky said:

look, i won't say that it's bad, but imho it would be last on the list of thing i'd want in reflex.

Your opinion weighs as much as mine in this matter, and you are allowed yours-- but it's one of the first things I'd want!

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I believe a capture point mode could work very well in Reflex.  If you're designing a map for it, have it symmetric from the middle to the bases, but design each point as it's own area so you would have a tdm style match near each point while each team attempts a capture. Controlling the areas and items would seem to be as required as normal game modes, but you'd have the benefit of a focus point.  The focus point may make the spectator aspect more enjoyable, and the tdm aspect keeps the game fun and high skill.

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I think this could bring new players to the game. The problem is that it would make Reflex offer more ways of actually playing the game. I mean in Quake and Reflex each gamemode can be considered as a whole game in it's own right. Some people play only CTF, some players only play 1v1, some players play only ATDM (worst mode ever)... I'm not sure if it's really a good Idea to have so many different modes in 1 game. It splits the community. I think the devs should first try to get more players. concentrate on adding a better learn section, coop vs bots, matchmaking, deathanimations + ragdoll, more cosmetics, more options (enemy outlines, crosshair color). When you add matchmaking.. You should think about what modes you want in Reflex.... Do you want traditional modes like TDM, CTF or do you want class based modes like all these TeamFortress-gamemodes or do you want some (objective based) Last Team Standing modes (Like Arena TDM or Bomb Defuse)? Since Reflex is a VERY competetive title (for a newbe skill ceiling is just too high to have so many super deep modes. It's hard enaugh to learn and play only 1 of these modes with acceptable results...)... So in my opinion Reflex should have 1 main team-gamemode (ranked). Other gamemodes should be there, but they should not get huge advertisement and they should be unranked.

 

Edit:

If you add Bomb Defuse you should also add some kind of economy system to that gamemode, because that's what makes this mode interessting and gives it depth. Also make it focussed on weapons. Armors and MH should be buyable aswell, but make them extremely expensive and limit MH and RA to 1 or 2 per team. Maybe also add additional items like different types of grenades (Smoke grenades and Team Fortress Classic style concussion grenades), deployable cameras (picture in picture) etc. to that gamemode, because these things also add a lot to that kind of gameplay.

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17 hours ago, furyaxsfigkjhn said:

 

Edit

If you add Bomb Defuse you should also add some kind of economy system to that gamemode, because that's what makes this mode interessting and gives it depth. Also make it focussed on weapons. Armors and MH should be buyable aswell, but make them extremely expensive and limit MH and RA to 1 or 2 per team. Maybe also add additional items like different types of grenades (Smoke grenades and Team Fortress Classic style concussion grenades), deployable cameras (picture in picture) etc. to that gamemode, because these things also add a lot to that kind of gameplay.

See, this is where everything fucks up.What you just said mixes CS and TF together which would make it completely opposite to what Reflex is right now. 

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