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TornadoStorm

PLEASE make 200ms playable!

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Best they can do is make your hitscans remain client side detected, I can't ever imagine a solution where projectiles are portrayed accurately with a 0.2 sec delay.

Wasn't there some kind of lag compensation limit in Reflex for hitscans too btw? I've always wondered the logic behind that. 

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4 minutes ago, Smilecythe said:

Best they can do is make your hitscans remain client side detected, I can't ever imagine a solution where projectiles are portrayed accurately with a 0.2 sec delay.

Wasn't there some kind of lag compensation limit in Reflex for hitscans too btw? I've always wondered the logic behind that. 

The issue is that I can play on almost every other game with 200+ ping, including CS: GO, Natural Selection 2, and TF2. With Reflex, almost every weapon has extreme delay after shooting, I teleport when I rocket jump or plasma climb, making that impossible, and even simply getting hit with a rocket teleports me. I know that the more server-side processing, the less bullshit the game is, but I am quite dissapointed at the netcode in this game for anything above 150ms :/

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Of course, all of those games have client side detection on hitscan weapons since majority of the weapons are hitscans. There's nothing specific done to the projectiles in those games, they have the same exact behavior and delay as projectiles in Reflex has. Delayed projectiles are a lot easier to adjust to than hitscans so it's hard to tell the difference unless you're making comparison with hitscans.

It would seem that Reflex simply does not have client side detection for hitscans above a certain ping. The client side detection works just fine in Quakeworld, Nexuiz and Xonotic. I don't see why it wouldn't work in Reflex as well and naturally I don't disagree with your suggestion.

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4 hours ago, Smilecythe said:

Of course, all of those games have client side detection on hitscan weapons since majority of the weapons are hitscans. There's nothing specific done to the projectiles in those games, they have the same exact behavior and delay as projectiles in Reflex has. Delayed projectiles are a lot easier to adjust to than hitscans so it's hard to tell the difference unless you're making comparison with hitscans.

It would seem that Reflex simply does not have client side detection for hitscans above a certain ping. The client side detection works just fine in Quakeworld, Nexuiz and Xonotic. I don't see why it wouldn't work in Reflex as well and naturally I don't disagree with your suggestion.

Pretty sure CSGO doesn't have clientside detection, because the concept of clientside detection is pretty shit. The netcode in csgo was just optimized for high ping.

Unless you want to get hit behind corners all the time there's no way to make up for 200ms with extrapolation and backwards reconciliation. Not worth the time and effort trying to find a solution for this either, considering that NA can play vs EU just fine.

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46 minutes ago, seekax said:

Pretty sure CSGO doesn't have clientside detection, because the concept of clientside detection is pretty shit. The netcode in csgo was just optimized for high ping.

Unless you want to get hit behind corners all the time there's no way to make up for 200ms with extrapolation and backwards reconciliation. Not worth the time and effort trying to find a solution for this either, considering that NA can play vs EU just fine.

I guess you have a point. This game is created to be as fair as possible and I wouldn't want to get railed by someone around a corner who has 300ms when I'm playing at 50ms :L using interpolation methods for projectiles wouldn't do too well either as the rockets would not have a fixed velocity, making them seem a lot less natural and predictable. I wouldn't expect much of a solution to the issue of playing such a game at a fairly high ping. CS GO also has around the corner kills, and that just wouldn't fit in a game like Reflex. I guess I'll just have to either get used to it, or wait till this game gets to South Africa or something :P

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i played a game unlagged to 300ms and it was awful; dying to people who no longer had LoS to me because my location pings to them, they decide to fire, it pings back to the server, and by the time i died on his client, on mine i'm in another room.

sorry but that feels like shit when i'm playing; not to mention the packet loss and mis-timestamping the packets get at that ping.  the solution is to play local servers, and if there aren't any .. make one.

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2 hours ago, Sky said:

i played a game unlagged to 300ms and it was awful; dying to people who no longer had LoS to me because my location pings to them, they decide to fire, it pings back to the server, and by the time i died on his client, on mine i'm in another room.

sorry but that feels like shit when i'm playing; not to mention the packet loss and mis-timestamping the packets get at that ping.  the solution is to play local servers, and if there aren't any .. make one.

Yeah, I'm trying hard to get more players here in Africa. Most I could get were a few friends of mine who joined my Reflex Kenya steam group, but they rarely play the game :L

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On 4/16/2016 at 4:34 PM, seekax said:

Pretty sure CSGO doesn't have clientside detection, because the concept of clientside detection is pretty shit. The netcode in csgo was just optimized for high ping.

Unless you want to get hit behind corners all the time there's no way to make up for 200ms with extrapolation and backwards reconciliation. Not worth the time and effort trying to find a solution for this either, considering that NA can play vs EU just fine.

Well, I don't play CS:GO so I can't tell, but TF2 definitely does have clientside detection and you get shot behind corners. If you don't want to get hit behind corners then you don't voluntarily play against 200ms players, quite simple as that :) 

Also, "getting shot behind the corner" is inaccurate. What actually happens is that you got hit when you were visible and the damage simply comes in delay.

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the game is optimized for sub 80 pings, and it does that incredibly well. Assuming that you can have a best of both worlds solution for incredibly high latency and well performing netcode, with the budget and human resources reflex has is (nearly) impossible. unless you want the next two years of development devoted to gutting the netcode and rewriting something thats not broken.

I cope I didnt come off off as a cunt, the tone this is written in was not my intention.  I'm really hopeful to see people enjoying reflex outside of EU NA and AUS.

 

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On 16.4.2016 at 8:34 AM, seekax said:

Pretty sure CSGO doesn't have clientside detection, because the concept of clientside detection is pretty shit. The netcode in csgo was just optimized for high ping.

I don:t know it does or doesn:t but its easy to play with 230-240ms so whatever they have it works

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1 minute ago, sawa said:

I don:t know it does or doesn:t but its easy to play with 230-240ms so whatever they have it works

OT: CS:GO's netocode is also incredibly unfair. Playing with 65 ping vs 20 ping - you can't hold corners as you die before they really show up on your screen fully (usually only should is seen and you can't even react). It goes both ways so you can also entry frag like crazy with higher ping, but you need to miss if you'd like to hit a moving target (shoot ahead) so good luck hitting an ADAD spamming opponent. Hit detection is 100% server sided, you even have spread separated from client and server, kill confirmations come in late etc. In my experience Reflex netcode is a lot more fair as long as you have decently low ping (<80 as others say).

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22 hours ago, banReflex said:

OT: CS:GO's netocode is also incredibly unfair. Playing with 65 ping vs 20 ping - you can't hold corners as you die before they really show up on your screen fully (usually only should is seen and you can't even react). It goes both ways so you can also entry frag like crazy with higher ping, but you need to miss if you'd like to hit a moving target (shoot ahead) so good luck hitting an ADAD spamming opponent. Hit detection is 100% server sided, you even have spread separated from client and server, kill confirmations come in late etc. In my experience Reflex netcode is a lot more fair as long as you have decently low ping (<80 as others say).

 

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11 hours ago, memphis said:

you can always play ctf and lag yourself out of enemy base without getting hit.

Do you become hard to hit with high ping in Reflex? If that's the case, client side detection would fix that too.. Unless the player is warping with an enormous packet loss or something.

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Hahah I really hope so ;p but either way it's no fun with high ping :L Only solution I can think of while living over here is to get as many people playing this game as possible, that's pretty hard though since most of the gaming community here consists of CoD and Battlefield only fanboys xD (Not that those games are bad, it's that they won't play anything else)

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On 18/4/2016 at 7:54 PM, banReflex said:

OT: CS:GO's netocode is also incredibly unfair. Playing with 65 ping vs 20 ping - you can't hold corners as you die before they really show up on your screen fully (usually only should is seen and you can't even react). It goes both ways so you can also entry frag like crazy with higher ping, but you need to miss if you'd like to hit a moving target (shoot ahead) so good luck hitting an ADAD spamming opponent. Hit detection is 100% server sided, you even have spread separated from client and server, kill confirmations come in late etc. In my experience Reflex netcode is a lot more fair as long as you have decently low ping (<80 as others say).

https://developer.valvesoftware.com/wiki/Source_Multiplayer_Networking

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I understand how angles work etc. but playing a ton of HS only FFA with 30-65 ping vs 5-20 pings has clearly showed me how it works. I've never done well with 60-65 ping and always do a lot better at lower pings. I need to miss a bit to get a HS on a moving target at that ping. It can't possibly be a coincidence that every time I had much higher ping I did much worse.

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