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Global vs Non-Global Sounds

Global vs Non-Global  

60 members have voted

  1. 1. Do you prefer Global sounds or Non-Global sounds for competitive duels?

    • Global.
      32
    • Non-Global.
      28


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On 11.9.2016 at 4:48 PM, banReflex said:

At the moment sound positioning confuses me to no end, it's not only impossible to tell if somebody is above or below, even left or right is very confusing, same for distance. I see all the better players mostly rely on pickup sound, map knowledge and logic to figure out where the other guy is rather than by sound positioning. Non-global sounds add ever more confusion.

That is exactly one of the problems at the moment. For nearby players it is nearly impossible to say from which direction they come. I also want to say it is not only about duels here what people should keep in mind. We have an active ffa and atdm community. It cripples the game to a certain extend as it is impossible to locate where a fight might be on the map when you are totally lost in silence and therefore it is harder to support your teammates.

I mean it's ok to say devs are gonna fix that in the future but please don't implement a feature when it is half baked and please think about how such drastic changes might affect different game modes also. Even when I shoot a rocket on Static Discharge from one side of the level to the other I can't here the impact sound. I think that does not contribite to "a natural feeling" of the environment.

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i dont mind either, aslong as they are predictable and consistent. the problem with the current system is that you cant really know if you missed a sound or not... the presence of sound or lack thereof kicks in so suddenly that 300u can be the difference between hearing a sound clearly and not hearing it at all. 

anyway, i think that to make a (properly implemented) non global sound system actually have a significant impact on gameplay, it would probably require it to be heavy attenuated to the extent that you wouldnt be able to hear pickups unless you are in the same room/really close but i suspect that might have other side effects on the game.

my ideal sound system would be one that takes account for the geometry of the map - ie, rather than hearing the RA pickup sound 'through' the wall, you would hear it come from whatever routes/LOS you have on red armour room etc. as a basic example, on catalyst, if you were standing at MH YA, and enemy took IC YA, rather than hearing YA pickup come from through the wall, you would hear it, attenuated for distance etc as coming from the 50hp corridor.

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On 9/9/2016 at 7:55 PM, Qualx said:

I consider that non-global sounds are directly equivalent to limiting visibility with fog. It's one thing for mappers to be able to place soundproof walls or sound-dampening walls - that's a map-based decision, and I think it'd be a good thing if implemented well - but it's quite another arbitrarily to withhold information based only on range. I'm also not a fan of clocktiming, and losing global pickup sounds in particular is crippling if you want to be able to time by instinct. With an already disproportionately high reward attached to clocktiming, there's no need to increase that further.

Non-global sounds may have their place, but I don't think that place is in a fast-paced, competitive game like Reflex. People talk about mindgames, but ultimately, mindgames based on uncertainty boil down to luck. Also, making it even harder to keep track of a player who hides all the time makes that particular playstyle even more boring to play against. Potentially, having player movement/shooting sounds non-global might enable slightly more freedom of movement for the out-of-control player, but I think it's a major detriment to the game for pickups not to be audible from anywhere.

WELL SAID 

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Whatever the current sound system in Experimental mode is... it needs to be reduced significantly. Just watch Necrophag1st POV in the King of America #2 and see how sound can be abused. There was almost never a moment where he didn't know where his opponent was. It is equivalent to wall hacking. Having the ability to always know your opponent's location is a bad idea in any competitive game mode in any game (fps or not). It removes a certain level of skill.

Kyto says it promotes slow-play... I believe global sounds promote slow-play even more because you can easily hear everything from the center of most maps and use that information to walk to a location in which your opponent is not. 

Slow-play isn't necessarily a bad thing either in FPS gaming because it adds more strategic game-play and sneak attack opportunities for the out of control player. Of course - this is just my opinion. I have been watching/playing the FPS genre for 19 years now... so my experience on the matter is higher than most.

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I'm in for global sounds, but limited sound range - so you should perhaps still not hear pickups or explosions when its way far off in the distance to reduce overall noise. Not hearing something wouldn't be due to being behind a wall, but a simple matter of being outside of it's reach. What I liked about the sound limitation most was that I didn't hear teleporter ambience all across the map like used to in early alpha versions. It was a real headache. 

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@kev! if the sound system is so easy to use, why is it that newer players always say to me that they have no idea where i am most of the time even when im playing fast etc? hearing the sound is one thing (which can be hard enough when your mind is thinking of other game related things - timing, positioning etc), processing and interpreting what you hear is something else, and where it absolutely becomes a skill to me.  

i agree with kyto, that lack of sound information would lead to slower play - the fact that you can deal damage so explosively in reflex would make players far more cautious and they wouldnt really want to hop around when they are uncertain where their enemy is for fear they would get hard punished for it. 

as for your walking example - the lack of sound in a global sound system is also information, and not hearing you move around i would know you are sneaking around somewhere; id then think for 1/2 a sec where you might be hiding and probably find you quite easily.

despite this, there are plenty of players that use a more strategic and slower paced approach and do very well with it... as an example you might enjoy - Rama is known for his fast paced in your face style, but he is quite often frustrated by players like Terifire - who tend to play more slowly, keeping the enemy at distance and springing traps etc. 

As for your last statement... your experience doesnt stop you being wrong ;)

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12 hours ago, thelawenforcer said:

@kev! if the sound system is so easy to use, why is it that newer players always say to me that they have no idea where i am most of the time even when im playing fast etc? hearing the sound is one thing (which can be hard enough when your mind is thinking of other game related things - timing, positioning etc), processing and interpreting what you hear is something else, and where it absolutely becomes a skill to me.  

i agree with kyto, that lack of sound information would lead to slower play - the fact that you can deal damage so explosively in reflex would make players far more cautious and they wouldnt really want to hop around when they are uncertain where their enemy is for fear they would get hard punished for it. 

as for your walking example - the lack of sound in a global sound system is also information, and not hearing you move around i would know you are sneaking around somewhere; id then think for 1/2 a sec where you might be hiding and probably find you quite easily.

despite this, there are plenty of players that use a more strategic and slower paced approach and do very well with it... as an example you might enjoy - Rama is known for his fast paced in your face style, but he is quite often frustrated by players like Terifire - who tend to play more slowly, keeping the enemy at distance and springing traps etc. 

As for your last statement... your experience doesnt stop you being wrong ;)

To continue on this, global sounds didn't stop Ivan O from being a ghost, haunting people in duels.

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